Comment by Robert Jango on October 31, 2012 at 3:13am

Petco recently bought 100+ fish farms in Florida. I don't remember the exact number but it looks like they're trying to corner the market. Other species are imported dirt cheap from SE Asia. 

American/Canadian hobbyists have taken a chunk out of the pet fish industry through sites like Aquabid.com. But these sites don't let you look at a fish before you buy it. So I still see a place for brick and mortar stores. I think a co-op style store that allowed customers to sell their fish to other customers/the public for a fee might work. The store might also be able to ship fish for local breeders. Setting up a shipping/breeding operation in your home can get pretty messy; so that's another reason a coop might appeal to serious hobbyists. 

Pursue your dream Derick but be real careful. Try selling fish out of your home first before you plunk down a penny. Dustin sells tons of plants but I'll bet his bottom line isn't that great. His choice of plants over fish is an excellent one

Comment by Derick cotten on October 31, 2012 at 3:24am

Thanks for the advice, im stationed in hawaii and its sad alot of lfs are closing or have already gone out of business because of petco and the`re about to open their first petsmart here on oahu. But yes it is my dream, i was injured in afghanistan and now im trying to use my resources to get this going thanks for your comment

Comment by Robert Jango on October 31, 2012 at 4:12am

First of all, thanx for your service in Afghanastan....

Petco is basically the McDonalds of the pet fish industry - there's a place for it but its nothing to write home about. Heck, even I visit Petco once in awhile. What's needed is an alternative business/operational model. Thanks to the internet there are more sophisticated customers and the ability to sell fish and plants nationally - well beyond the traditional 3 mile radius of local fish stores. Clearly Aquabid has drawn first blood in the shipping area but its not an ideal operational model in my humble opinion.

Let me know how it goes Derick. Its probably better to PM me with detailed stuff. I'm gonna talk to some influential people pretty soon with my ideas. I'll let you know how it goes.  

Comment by Derick cotten on October 31, 2012 at 4:30am

sounds good ill keep you posted

Comment by Chatter89324234 on November 1, 2012 at 6:47pm

I think it would be a lot of work to run a full time LFS, it would be much easier to sell anything you breed or stock up on within an aquarium society and simply enjoy having a large fish room.

If I were to open an LFS it would emulate a bird farm that I know of locally that breeds its own stock and is only open three days a week.  I think the co-op idea combined with working with fellow members of an aquarium society would help to diversify your stock and encourage others to get deeper into the hobby knowing they aren't going to drown in fish if they expand into breeding themselves.

Comment by Robert Jango on November 2, 2012 at 3:20am

Good stuff VariousW, especially about aquarium societies. I see them as the lynchpin of a new business model that will emerge out of the present day pet fish industry. Of course the eight hundred pound gorilla in the room is land and utilities. Like they say in the real estate business, "location, location, location". A central, easily accessible location is the best (and most expensive) place to put a fish farm. After all, teenagers are a huge part of the customer base in the aquarium hobby and many of them don't have cars. I think owning land would be an economic necessity and a greenhouse style structure or skylight roof a big help with utilities. And while I'm fantasizing lets throw in a water front location with a fresh water well in the middle of Manhattan. (Come to think of it, all of Lower Manhattan is on the waterfront these days.)  

I'm gonna broach the idea with some people at the New England Aquarium and see how they react. I'm sure as hell not expecting them to hug me, but if they don't laugh in my face I'll take that as a moral victory - and a foot in the door.   

I think its interesting that Dustin built a greenhouse. I don't see it as his master plan to expand the Fishtank TV empire - frankly I think he just loves the hobby. But, then again, he's not below capitalizing on an opportunity if it ever came his way.  

Although we know selling fish on the internet has become a successful part of the business, I think, as I said before, brick and mortar is, and will always be, a superior method for selling pets. I won't go into all the reasons for this, but it makes me think of the song "How much is that Doggy in the Window?" It just doesn't work as well if the doggy is on the computer. Or think of it as going to the zoo as opposed to watching animals on TV.

Comment by ŦůRbö ۰ Ҏяѻ ۰ on November 5, 2012 at 7:01pm

I was thinking of starting one too. Even went out and got my degree in business. I too was injured in Iraq in 04, (Snipers suck) with the Marines; so I have that money coming it. But where I live the market for "mom n pop" shops is not great. I live in Phoenix, Az where 10 years ago there were 20 to 30 LFS, we are down to one freshwater and 3 saltwater only stores now a days. Petsmart and Petco are killing them; as well as the internet. With Petsmart and "big box" stores they can sell fish and fish related products at 2 to 5% over cost; and offer a 2 week, bring the fish back, no questions asked guarantee; LFS cant do that, or they will be giving fish away for free, and they can not just sell to trusted, skilled Aquariumist. "Big box" stores make most of thier money from dog and cat supplies, grooming, and other sales. If you try to compete with that you wont break even; just something to think about. Need to find a market area where the demand is high enough to make money; or I can get some Marines together and we can "take out" the Petsmarts where you want to start your shop. I think thats a joke. lol

Comment by Derick cotten on November 5, 2012 at 7:19pm

Hahahaha i like the way you think. Im stationed in oahu, but im from glendale az.

Comment by Robert Jango on November 6, 2012 at 4:02am

Didn't know you were a badass vet Turbo. Thanks.

The market for mom n pop shops is dying everywhere. In Boston we've gone from numerous fish stores to a "hole in the wall" in Chinatown that sells mostly goldfish. The internet is the biggest threat to small fish stores in my opinion, but its also hurting Petco by creating more knowledgable hobbyists and an alternate market for supplies and specialty products. ( BTW, excellent breakdown of box store economics Turbo) The opportunity today lies between box stores and the internet. The days of an owner pulling down six figures a year with a fish store are gone. Profits will be significantly smaller but more democratic in a co-op with members pulling down enough to expand and subsidize their hobby. The exception will be a few people with scientific backgrounds who use the co-op to expand and showcase their personal consulting businesses. The growing income gap has been a boon for consulting and related high end fields like pond maintenance, custom aquariums, and anything saltwater. As for Petco... they'll never go away for the same reason McDonalds won't - a steady supply of low denominator consumers who demand convenience over quality.

I think the depressed fish industry presents a great opportunity for those with innovative ideas. [see above VariousWeapon's post] And even though he's not selling fish you gotta admire what Dustin's doing. Plants are custom made for the internet - so easy to ship. 

Studying biology and business gives you a huge advantage. I spoke with a chemist tonight for two hours and he blew away a lot of the "science" I've been preaching on this site for months - very humbling. He tells me it took him 10 years to understand aquarium science despite working as a chemist for 22 years.

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